Whether it's your first Bonnaroo or you’re a music festival veteran, we welcome you to Inforoo.
Here you'll find info about artists, rumors, camping tips, and the infamous Roo Clues. Have a look around then create an account and join in the fun. See you at Bonnaroo!!
THANK YOU! I have nothing against the sport itself, but I have a lot of feelings about the way our culture idolizes the players and how much they get paid.
There is a lot I could say about my disgust for what football as a whole has become, but I'll just say look up the Steubenville, Ohio high school rape case involving football players and their coach. My sister is a teacher in that area. She had her job threatened because she decided to go after the coach and superintendent for their involvement with trying to cover up the incident. The rape (and 16 year olds were granted permission to party here, even provided beer and other party favors by adults) took place at a property owned by coach. My sister knew a lot about what was going on with all this and most people, faculty and friends alike, told her to keep her mouth shut, or lose her job.
Well, in short, football reigns supreme. And, I've had enough of being any part of that.
A woman I work with has said, in many more words, that Derek Jeter is a horrible person because he pays for the cab rides/orders a car service and gives the ladies he takes home a gift basket. Yet, Rapistburger & Dogfighter Guy are just great guys she'd like to have a beer and party with.
5.5/four tet, daphni b2b floating points, avalon emerson 5.12/neil young 5.19/mannequin pussy 5.21/serpentwithfeet 5.25/hozier 6.12-16/bonnaroo 6.28/goose 6.29/goose 9.17/the national + the war on drugs 9.23/sigur ros 9.27-29/making time 10.17/air
I like watching football, among other sports. But I don't pretend that someone with exemplary athletic skills must be a good person. People who have wealth and privilege have more opportunities for bad behavior. If they behave horribly, then they deserve to be condemned for it. But if I decide to only watch sporting events or other types of entertainment when I'm confident that those performing are honorable human beings, then I'm going to spend a lot of time watching Mr. Rogers reruns.
[This is a great opportunity for someone to point out some detestable conduct by Fred Rogers that I was unaware of.]
I like watching football, among other sports. But I don't pretend that someone with exemplary athletic skills must be a good person. People who have wealth and privilege have more opportunities for bad behavior. If they behave horribly, then they deserve to be condemned for it. But if I decide to only watch sporting events or other types of entertainment when I'm confident that those performing are honorable human beings, then I'm going to spend a lot of time watching Mr. Rogers reruns.
[This is a great opportunity for someone to point out some detestable conduct by Fred Rogers that I was unaware of.]
There was a dead worm/caterpillar looking thing in my spinach!!!!! Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck!!!!!! One of those big plastic containers of organic baby spinach. I had 2 salads with this spinach last week and was picking leaves carefully today because some of them were starting to go bad... what if it wasn't going bad and I just grabbed a handful per usual?!?!?! ajfskljfskjngsnmmagmkljflaiwjrklanf,manfg,.asdg I don't usually wash my pre "thoroughly washed" spinach, but I might have to start.
Welcome back Bonz, but I do not find it strange that your presence being requested in the Orgy thread and then you showing up, like it was the quacking Bonzai Bat Signal.
There was a dead worm/caterpillar looking thing in my spinach!!!!! Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck!!!!!! One of those big plastic containers of organic baby spinach. I had 2 salads with this spinach last week and was picking leaves carefully today because some of them were starting to go bad... what if it wasn't going bad and I just grabbed a handful per usual?!?!?! ajfskljfskjngsnmmagmkljflaiwjrklanf,manfg,.asdg I don't usually wash my pre "thoroughly washed" spinach, but I might have to start.
There are a lot of good people in professional sports who are either athletes or organizational people and who do a tremendous amount of good. They have to feel like shit this week.
A lot of the arguments are based around how silly it is to pretend like we know these athletes because they do carefully constructed interviews and that we shouldn't give money and fame to these horrible people applies to many of the artists that perform at Bonnaroo and festivals everywhere.
Unfortunately we only hear about that bad. Maybe not only hear about, but it's heard much more and made a much bigger deal of than someone doing good.
My biggest issue with football in general is that I just think it's a crappy sport. The bad behavior only ices the cake. But that poor behavior is in every professional sport so, I'll just admit to being a hypocrite now.
There are a lot of good people in professional sports who are either athletes or organizational people and who do a tremendous amount of good. They have to feel like shit this week.
A lot of the arguments are based around how silly it is to pretend like we know these athletes because they do carefully constructed interviews and that we shouldn't give money and fame to these horrible people applies to many of the artists that perform at Bonnaroo and festivals everywhere.
I'm talking about the entire culture of football, the institution, and the rabid fans. Football players, especially the good ones, are given entitlement and favoritism from an early age: high school. Musicians are treated like outcasts, misfits normally from an early age. Football players are given hand-outs, free passes, ridiculous scholarships, hell, free cars and money just to attend a university. It carries on if they make it pro and gets even more ridiculous, talking million dollar salaries and even more special treatment. In school, often times, faculty and administration "help out" to keep the players grades up *wink *wink. Penciling in those high test scores for absentee players and so on. I don't think musicians ever get that sort of special treatment in society, not until they make it really big, which most don't today. Parents are so proud it seems if their son is a star football player. Haven't heard too much about proud parents of the high school musician.
Oh, and yeah, Penn State. Lovely example of pretty much an entire sports program choosing to protect the wonderful sport of football over protecting small children. Reminds me of the Catholic church. I can continue on with a slew of examples of aggressive crimes football players have been accused of, but I'm sure you already know.
I've had many football fans tell me that they could care less what a player does off the field as long as he is making the play on the field. This mentality carried by fans of the game sickens me. I am tired too of the ridiculous behavior of the lunatic fans in general. It's too violent and confrontational for me. I know, football is a violent sport. But does it have to be to the point of the bone crushing hits on the field and the ignorant drunken behavior in the stands? I guess that's just my personal distaste.
Injuries in football, especially for youngsters (which I hear tackle football for 6 year olds is becoming a thing now), takes away a big part of some of these dudes' lives. That's sad too. Brain injuries especially. We'd rather push some of our young men to hurt themselves, not get a decent education, or to become well-rounded people in general, all in the name of football and potentially leaving them with a pretty bleak future.
There was a dead worm/caterpillar looking thing in my spinach!!!!! Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck!!!!!! One of those big plastic containers of organic baby spinach. I had 2 salads with this spinach last week and was picking leaves carefully today because some of them were starting to go bad... what if it wasn't going bad and I just grabbed a handful per usual?!?!?! ajfskljfskjngsnmmagmkljflaiwjrklanf,manfg,.asdg I don't usually wash my pre "thoroughly washed" spinach, but I might have to start.
There are a lot of good people in professional sports who are either athletes or organizational people and who do a tremendous amount of good. They have to feel like shit this week.
A lot of the arguments are based around how silly it is to pretend like we know these athletes because they do carefully constructed interviews and that we shouldn't give money and fame to these horrible people applies to many of the artists that perform at Bonnaroo and festivals everywhere.
I'm talking about the entire culture of football, the institution, and the rabid fans. Football players, especially the good ones, are given entitlement and favoritism from an early age: high school. Musicians are treated like outcasts, misfits normally from an early age. Football players are given hand-outs, free passes, ridiculous scholarships, hell, free cars and money just to attend a university. It carries on if they make it pro and gets even more ridiculous, talking million dollar salaries and even more special treatment. In school, often times, faculty and administration "help out" to keep the players grades up *wink *wink. Penciling in those high test scores for absentee players and so on. I don't think musicians ever get that sort of special treatment in society, not until they make it really big, which most don't today. Parents are so proud it seems if their son is a star football player. Haven't heard too much about proud parents of the high school musician.
Oh, and yeah, Penn State. Lovely example of pretty much an entire sports program choosing to protect the wonderful sport of football over protecting small children. Reminds me of the Catholic church. I can continue on with a slew of examples of aggressive crimes football players have been accused of, but I'm sure you already know.
I've had many football fans tell me that they could care less what a player does off the field as long as he is making the play on the field. This mentality carried by fans of the game sickens me. I am tired too of the ridiculous behavior of the lunatic fans in general. It's too violent and confrontational for me. I know, football is a violent sport. But does it have to be to the point of the bone crushing hits on the field and the ignorant drunken behavior in the stands? I guess that's just my personal distaste.
Injuries in football, especially for youngsters (which I hear tackle football for 6 year olds is becoming a thing now), takes away a big part of some of these dudes' lives. That's sad too. Brain injuries especially. We'd rather push some of our young men to hurt themselves, not get a decent education, or to become well-rounded people in general, all in the name of football and potentially leaving them with a pretty bleak future.
Your setting up a dichotomy between overly coddled football players and outcast, paid-their-dues musicians that I don't think is valid. There are people who play football and get no special treatment and there are musicians who are given ridiculous levels of wealth and adoration from a relatively early age. If a musician gets caught behaving dishonorably, do you stop listening to him or her?
As one example, I consider Chuck Berry to be the one true king of Rock 'n Roll. I base that on my love for his music, not his personal behavior, such as (allegedly) installing video cameras in the women's room of a restaurant he owned. I think you can appreciate someone's talent and still recognize flaws in their personal behavior.
There was a dead worm/caterpillar looking thing in my spinach!!!!! Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck Yuck!!!!!! One of those big plastic containers of organic baby spinach. I had 2 salads with this spinach last week and was picking leaves carefully today because some of them were starting to go bad... what if it wasn't going bad and I just grabbed a handful per usual?!?!?! ajfskljfskjngsnmmagmkljflaiwjrklanf,manfg,.asdg I don't usually wash my pre "thoroughly washed" spinach, but I might have to start.
Blergh! Okay, you beat my gigantic clump of hair in a bagel story. Go demand your free month of produce or whatever... you've earned it.
There's a worm-like creature here called the wichetty grub that's used for bush tucker. They look weird, but taste surprisingly okay! (we ate them on Outward Bound). Not haute cuisine, but not disgusting either. Hungry, anyone?
Welcome back Bonz, but I do not find it strange that your presence being requested in the Orgy thread and then you showing up, like it was the quacking Bonzai Bat Signal.
I just think the narrative in the argument is misguided on a national scale (not you specifically). So much of this has been made to be not an issue with these individuals or society as a whole but with the company and industry in which they are employed. I don't get that. If you want to be mad at the NFL there are many valid reasons. The homophobia in locker rooms, any potential cover up of crimes, and this from a recent NYT article:
The N.F.L.’s actuaries assumed that 28 percent of all players would be found to have one of the compensable diseases and that the league would pay out $900 million to them. Their calculations showed that players younger than 50 had an 0.8 percent chance of developing Alzheimer’s or dementia, compared with less than 0.1 percent for the general population. For players ages 50 to 54, the rate was 1.4 percent, compared with less than 0.1 percent for the general population. The gap between the players and the general population grows wider with increasing age.
Football provides an outlet for thousands of young men every year to escape a life of poverty and get an education at some of the best institutions in the country. Unfortunately those scholarships can result in the student-athletes being permanently injured and exploited for profit by the schools and the NCAA. There are a lot of things going on in the youth, HS, college, and pro levels that is shady or reprehensible. I understand the toll football can have on your body. My combined concussions + broken bones + surgeries + ligament tears + dislocations and other injuries is in the 20s and most of that is from football. The concussions specifically has impacted my life in a major way. There is no way my non-existent and hypothetical future children would be playing football before high school, if at all. That being said, I would do it all over again. I never want to be an Al Bundy, but those were some of the best years of my life.
If you don't like football for those reasons, then I understand and I am certain that your opinion will be a majority opinion within a few decades. If football goes the way of boxing I can live with that, I just hope they take the UFC/MMA with them.
To be clear, I am disgusted on the Ray Rice/McDonald/Hardy/Peterson issues and have been the whole time. I thought at the time a 2 game suspension was absurd. The Ravens twitter quoting Janay Rice about how she had a role in the incident was amazingly tone deaf. The new policy of 6 games then indefinite suspension was more or less PR as is the NFL creating a new VP to oversee these issues. To then release and suspend Ray Rice after the video came out was backtracking and stupid and doesn't seem to make much sense legally. Even if Ray Rice wasn't completely forthright with the league office, I personally don't need to see a video of each incident to know domestic violence is horrible 100% of the time regardless of the severity and individual details of the case. For all of those reasons, the NFL is taking a lot of heat and they deserve it.
The Penn St case will forever be sickening. Their eligibility for postseason play was restored while the Ray Rice thing was going on and I wish more heat had been thrown the NCAAs way. It's indefensible.
James Brown (the studio host, not the singer) was 100% dead on when he talked about the societal issues being more important than just Ray Rice. There should be zero tolerance for domestic violence at every company nationwide not just the NFL. The people who wore Ray Rice jerseys Thursday or the horrible woman with the 'switch' and the Peterson jersey on Sunday are absolute morons and horrible human beings every day of the week, not just Sunday. 90% of your argument is regarding the people who treat these athletes as kings. Take away football or any other sport and those same people are just as likely to be enablers in some other way. The meatheads and morons who cheer for laundry regardless of their personal lives are likely to be idiots in most of the other facets of their lives. So many people are mad at Goodell but not the owners of the team. Where are the angry Twitter mobs going after Biscotti, Wolfe, and the others? It's an issue with the people in society and not just 32 local franchises. The public outcry involving the NFL should revolve around any potential cover up and/or failure to act. I can't think of a single time when someone who was not famous and just a local resident near me did something morally and/or legally wrong and then I ended up mad at that individuals employer more than the individual who did it. The real anger/discussion should be directed not just at professional athletes or the league that employs them but for the people who root for these teams and what they deem acceptable. That should also involve people who don't like football. What does it mean to be a man and what are the expectations? How should we treat the other sex? How can one do something so violent for work and leave the violence, anger, and hyped up masculinity at work and out of the rest of your life?
Instead the majority of the conversations are around what did Goodell know, should they be suspended, is this a legit investigation, etc. Half of the conversation about Adrian Peterson is about whether he should be suspended and half is about if hitting your child is acceptable and I wish it was 100% of the conversation. I'm pissed off that they keep showing the elevator video over and over. I've never been involved in one of those situations but I imagine there are women out there that have flashbacks to their own instances of abuse when the elevator video is shown.
Yes there is a lot of horrible stuff in football but I and everyone else knew this before last week. I wish the discussion was more about what is wrong with society and not what is wrong with football. Those conversations (brain injury, NCAA corruption, etc.) have been out there forever and can be picked back up at any time. There is now a national focus being put on domestic violence and how the football industry responds when it should be an example for all people and all industries/employers. Despite all the ad money and TV ratings, the media and consumers drives football, its players, and all that $$ not the other way around. All employers should take tougher lines with their employees when it comes to domestic violence. If you think the NFL is the only business where star employees and replacement level employees are treated differently and that the NFL is the only company that tries to sweep things under the rug....
I agree with everything you said. I was a football fan. I enjoyed the sport and the tradition. Used to go to the games. Throw football parties. The whole nine yards. My attitude toward football started to change with the off the field violence against women, Michael Vick, Ray Lewis, arguments with my family and friends who would defend the, second time I might add, accused rapist quicker than look harshly at a beloved player (a franchise QB is way more valuable than "some 20 year old drunk girl's life"). Apparently, it wasn't just my inner circle who agreed: Vick was allowed to come back, Ben is still the Steelers QB. It's disgusting to me. Ben also got into some trouble here in Pittsburgh that was quickly covered up by the police and a club owner, which never made local or national news. This happened before the other "scandals" and that's about when I started thinking that I can't support something that allows men to behave and act this way. It's about as simple as that. I used to work for a rape crisis center and have dealt with violence against women my whole life, personally and as a advocate for change.
I said the "culture" of football. You say society as a whole. I wholeheartedly agree. I think though, football, more than any other sport or favorite American mega entertainment industry, music included, has a problem with its priorities and values. Is this a reflection of the larger American society? Absolutely. I said before that the way fans dismiss the bad behavior just so they can keep cheering it on sickens me. The way some parents push their kids to play, the way some high school and universities will do everything in their power to protect their football program is well, criminal. I don't speak to anyone about football anymore. This is the first time on this board I engaged in the dialogue. I wish I hadn't said a thing.
And, yes, billypilgrim, if I find someone truly offensive, no matter their talent, I stop listening and supporting that artist. I have changed a great deal the past few years of my life. The things I value and choose to spend my time engaging in have changed dramatically in my 30's. I guess I ain't got time no more for football or the Ted Nugents or R Kellys of this world. If I'm aware of something that, in my opinion, is wrong or really offensive to me, I just don't engage with it anymore. Sometimes, I'm not aware or that informed about a musician, such as R Kelly. After learning more about him, I ain't got time for him no more. It's just that simple with me. There are better things in life to do, be apart of, to think about for me than negatives or BS people. I have musicians that, at one time, I greatly admired and have now started to become downers for me, such as Wayne Coyne.
At any rate, my point is, if I really start to not like something because it compromises my morals, makes me feel "cheap," or seriously pisses me off (either as a woman or as a humanitarian), yeah, I start inching away from it, no matter how much I may have it enjoyed it at one time. I'm living and learning and growing. Life has gotten busier and fuller. I know better now who I am than I ever did. Football is not for me. As are certain artists. So on and so forth.
I just think the narrative in the argument is misguided on a national scale (not you specifically). So much of this has been made to be not an issue with these individuals or society as a whole but with the company and industry in which they are employed. I don't get that. If you want to be mad at the NFL there are many valid reasons. The homophobia in locker rooms, any potential cover up of crimes, and this from a recent NYT article: Football provides an outlet for thousands of young men every year to escape a life of poverty and get an education at some of the best institutions in the country. Unfortunately those scholarships can result in the student-athletes being permanently injured and exploited for profit by the schools and the NCAA. There are a lot of things going on in the youth, HS, college, and pro levels that is shady or reprehensible. I understand the toll football can have on your body. My combined concussions + broken bones + surgeries + ligament tears + dislocations and other injuries is in the 20s and most of that is from football. The concussions specifically has impacted my life in a major way. There is no way my non-existent and hypothetical future children would be playing football before high school, if at all. That being said, I would do it all over again. I never want to be an Al Bundy, but those were some of the best years of my life.
If you don't like football for those reasons, then I understand and I am certain that your opinion will be a majority opinion within a few decades. If football goes the way of boxing I can live with that, I just hope they take the UFC/MMA with them.
To be clear, I am disgusted on the Ray Rice/McDonald/Hardy/Peterson issues and have been the whole time. I thought at the time a 2 game suspension was absurd. The Ravens twitter quoting Janay Rice about how she had a role in the incident was amazingly tone deaf. The new policy of 6 games then indefinite suspension was more or less PR as is the NFL creating a new VP to oversee these issues. To then release and suspend Ray Rice after the video came out was backtracking and stupid and doesn't seem to make much sense legally. Even if Ray Rice wasn't completely forthright with the league office, I personally don't need to see a video of each incident to know domestic violence is horrible 100% of the time regardless of the severity and individual details of the case. For all of those reasons, the NFL is taking a lot of heat and they deserve it.
The Penn St case will forever be sickening. Their eligibility for postseason play was restored while the Ray Rice thing was going on and I wish more heat had been thrown the NCAAs way. It's indefensible.
James Brown (the studio host, not the singer) was 100% dead on when he talked about the societal issues being more important than just Ray Rice. There should be zero tolerance for domestic violence at every company nationwide not just the NFL. The people who wore Ray Rice jerseys Thursday or the horrible woman with the 'switch' and the Peterson jersey on Sunday are absolute morons and horrible human beings every day of the week, not just Sunday. 90% of your argument is regarding the people who treat these athletes as kings. Take away football or any other sport and those same people are just as likely to be enablers in some other way. The meatheads and morons who cheer for laundry regardless of their personal lives are likely to be idiots in most of the other facets of their lives. So many people are mad at Goodell but not the owners of the team. Where are the angry Twitter mobs going after Biscotti, Wolfe, and the others? It's an issue with the people in society and not just 32 local franchises. The public outcry involving the NFL should revolve around any potential cover up and/or failure to act. I can't think of a single time when someone who was not famous and just a local resident near me did something morally and/or legally wrong and then I ended up mad at that individuals employer more than the individual who did it. The real anger/discussion should be directed not just at professional athletes or the league that employs them but for the people who root for these teams and what they deem acceptable. That should also involve people who don't like football. What does it mean to be a man and what are the expectations? How should we treat the other sex? How can one do something so violent for work and leave the violence, anger, and hyped up masculinity at work and out of the rest of your life?
Instead the majority of the conversations are around what did Goodell know, should they be suspended, is this a legit investigation, etc. Half of the conversation about Adrian Peterson is about whether he should be suspended and half is about if hitting your child is acceptable and I wish it was 100% of the conversation. I'm pissed off that they keep showing the elevator video over and over. I've never been involved in one of those situations but I imagine there are women out there that have flashbacks to their own instances of abuse when the elevator video is shown.
Yes there is a lot of horrible stuff in football but I and everyone else knew this before last week. I wish the discussion was more about what is wrong with society and not what is wrong with football. Those conversations (brain injury, NCAA corruption, etc.) have been out there forever and can be picked back up at any time. There is now a national focus being put on domestic violence and how the football industry responds when it should be an example for all people and all industries/employers. Despite all the ad money and TV ratings, the media and consumers drives football, its players, and all that $$ not the other way around. All employers should take tougher lines with their employees when it comes to domestic violence. If you think the NFL is the only business where star employees and replacement level employees are treated differently and that the NFL is the only company that tries to sweep things under the rug....
I agree with everything you said. I was a football fan. I enjoyed the sport and the tradition. Used to go to the games. Throw football parties. The whole nine yards. My attitude toward football started to change with the off the field violence against women, Michael Vick, Ray Lewis, arguments with my family and friends who would defend the, second time I might add, accused rapist quicker than look harshly at a beloved player (a franchise QB is way more valuable than "some 20 year old drunk girl's life"). Apparently, it wasn't just my inner circle who agreed: Vick was allowed to come back, Ben is still the Steelers QB. It's disgusting to me. Ben also got into some trouble here in Pittsburgh that was quickly covered up by the police and a club owner, which never made local or national news. This happened before the other "scandals" and that's about when I started thinking that I can't support something that allows men to behave and act this way. It's about as simple as that. I used to work for a rape crisis center and have dealt with violence against women my whole life, personally and as a advocate for change.
I said the "culture" of football. You say society as a whole. I wholeheartedly agree. I think though, football, more than any other sport or favorite American mega entertainment industry, music included, has a problem with its priorities and values. Is this a reflection of the larger American society? Absolutely. I said before that the way fans dismiss the bad behavior just so they can keep cheering it on sickens me. The way some parents push their kids to play, the way some high school and universities will do everything in their power to protect their football program is well, criminal. I don't speak to anyone about football anymore. This is the first time on this board I engaged in the dialogue. I wish I hadn't said a thing.
And, yes, billypilgrim, if I find someone truly offensive, no matter their talent, I stop listening and supporting that artist. I have changed a great deal the past few years of my life. The things I value and choose to spend my time engaging in have changed dramatically in my 30's. I guess I ain't got time no more for football or the Ted Nugents or R Kellys of this world. If I'm aware of something that, in my opinion, is wrong or really offensive to me, I just don't engage with it anymore. Sometimes, I'm not aware or that informed about a musician, such as R Kelly. After learning more about him, I ain't got time for him no more. It's just that simple with me. There are better things in life to do, be apart of, to think about for me than negatives or BS people. I have musicians that, at one time, I greatly admired and have now started to become downers for me, such as Wayne Coyne.
At any rate, my point is, if I really start to not like something because it compromises my morals, makes me feel "cheap," or seriously pisses me off (either as a woman or as a humanitarian), yeah, I start inching away from it, no matter how much I may have it enjoyed it at one time. I'm living and learning and growing. Life has gotten busier and fuller. I know better now who I am than I ever did. Football is not for me. As are certain artists. So on and so forth.
I don't agree with everything here, but I'm glad you chose to express it. I do understand what you're saying and always respect your opinion.
I have so much music on my phone that I haven't updated iOS in ages, because I just don't have the space for it. Sometimes it can be a pain in the arse with certain apps - but today, it just means I haven't ended up with any shitty U2 albums I didn't want. Winning!