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Post by Roo'adelphia on Sept 12, 2016 11:14:46 GMT -5
The kids I doubt ill ever have because im forever immature wont be aloud to play football because of the A. risk of injury and B. because im 5'9 white guy and the chances of them playing after highschool are slim to non. My kids will be wizards whether they like it or not.
I 100% will let my kids play and feel no guilt watching football. If those guys don't wanna risk the injuries, all they have to do is turn those contracts for millions of dollars and get a regular job in the real world (news flash: 99.9% of them won't do that.) Playing in the NFL is a job that comes with known risk of injury and the players are paid more than a fair wage to take said risks. I grew up playing football all the way into college when I went to UF and took a large number of very painful hits. But, I never complained because I knew, as all high level football players do, that I was putting my body on the line every time I stepped on that field. I absolutely loved hitting in football. Going heads up with someone and making them look like a fool is one of the things I enjoy most in this world.
A child can not make a rational decision when it comes to fun vs safety and future health issues. You could tell a kid they could die doing something and they'll still do it if they think it will be fun. I don't think children with still developing brains should be allowed to play, personally. When they mature and understand the risk, then sure.
I 100% will let my kids play and feel no guilt watching football. If those guys don't wanna risk the injuries, all they have to do is turn those contracts for millions of dollars and get a regular job in the real world (news flash: 99.9% of them won't do that.) Playing in the NFL is a job that comes with known risk of injury and the players are paid more than a fair wage to take said risks. I grew up playing football all the way into college when I went to UF and took a large number of very painful hits. But, I never complained because I knew, as all high level football players do, that I was putting my body on the line every time I stepped on that field. I absolutely loved hitting in football. Going heads up with someone and making them look like a fool is one of the things I enjoy most in this world.
A child can not make a rational decision when it comes to fun vs safety and future health issues. You could tell a kid they could die doing something and they'll still do it if they think it will be fun. I don't think children with still developing brains should be allowed to play, personally. When they mature and understand the risk, then sure.
My question is where do you draw that line on age? Also, lets be clear, no study has been done to show that football at a young age has affected a large number of children's mental development. All of the studies show the damage that is endured by the professional athletes. That is because children do not have the physical strength yet to really pose a threat on damaging a child's brain. The kids simply are not strong enough or fast enough and can not hit hard enough cause real danger (aside from freak accidents.) if you want to argue not to let kids under 10 play or MAYBE 12 and under, I could possibly see it. But, it otherwise just seems like it fits with everyone trying to make their kids live in plastic bubbles their whole lives.
A child can not make a rational decision when it comes to fun vs safety and future health issues. You could tell a kid they could die doing something and they'll still do it if they think it will be fun. I don't think children with still developing brains should be allowed to play, personally. When they mature and understand the risk, then sure.
My question is where do you draw that line on age?
I think it depends on the child. When the parent believes the child is mature enough for that kind of choice, they'll allow it. I feel it's similar to children and firearms. I grew up on a farm and wasn't allowed to use a gun until my father believed I was mature enough to understand the power of what I was holding.
A child can not make a rational decision when it comes to fun vs safety and future health issues. You could tell a kid they could die doing something and they'll still do it if they think it will be fun. I don't think children with still developing brains should be allowed to play, personally. When they mature and understand the risk, then sure.
My question is where do you draw that line on age?
Well considering there isnt an age when ramming heads into eachother full speed is medically ok, id say until the kid can make the personal choice to willingly ram his head into another person and understand the repercussions instead of just getting barked orders to do so by a coach/parent. I also have the same stipulations on religion.
People who have children/plan on having children, would you let your child play football, knowing what we know about concussions and how big of a deal they are? Also, does anyone feel guilty about watching football?
i won't let my kids play. I worked with a football team for three years and was very athletic until I was 23. Concussions are a big part, but seeing the state of the players bodies due to other injuries.
I used to have to tape and double brace the starting center's shoulder into place EVERY DAY and it would still pop out. One guys Achilles was hanging on by a thread. Coaches wouldn't let these kids take the rest they needed to heal in the first place. These guys needed surgery. The coach wouldn't heed the medical advice of the team docs or training staff. That's a terrible culture.
I'm competitive as hell and have played through injuries. But if it came down to going to the doctor and being told I have to sit for a period of time, I'd choose that so I could continue to play in the future. I'm not gonna risk injuring myself to the point of never being able to play again.
A child can not make a rational decision when it comes to fun vs safety and future health issues. You could tell a kid they could die doing something and they'll still do it if they think it will be fun. I don't think children with still developing brains should be allowed to play, personally. When they mature and understand the risk, then sure.
My question is where do you draw that line on age? Also, lets be clear, no study has been done to show that football at a young age has affected a large number of children's mental development. All of the studies show the damage that is endured by the professional athletes. That is because children do not have the physical strength yet to really pose a threat on damaging a child's brain. The kids simply are not strong enough or fast enough and can not hit hard enough cause real danger (aside from freak accidents.) if you want to argue not to let kids under 10 play or MAYBE 12 and under, I could possibly see it. But, it otherwise just seems like it fits with everyone trying to make their kids live in plastic bubbles their whole lives.
Let's be clear. My wife and I both study the brain for a living. She works at a research lab in a children's hospital, I work at a neuroscience research lab at ASU. I don't say this to brag, I say it to make clear that what I am saying is coming from a place of educated authority. Most of your post is complete horse shiz. There are many, many studies that show that developing brains are much more susceptible to long term damage from traumatic brain injuries. A common misconception is that it is the hard hits that produce concussive symptoms that leads to long term CTE (chronic traumatic encephalopy). There is strong evidence that even sub-concussive trauma to the brain can produce lasting effects due to both damage of the physical tissue and to the repair mechanisms within the brain (which increases risk of future concussion/trauma; ie: concussions at a young age are correlated with increased concussions later on in life). The physical strength of the children is in many cases irrelevant. Concussions and traumatic brain injuries aren't always due to sheer force; there is a large component related to situational awareness, reaction time, attention, and other perceptive cues about the environment and approaching objects/people that can cause injury. Additionally, the relative force of a hit to the reactive force of what is being hit is important for brain injuries, not the magnitude of the actual force fo the hit itself. ALL of these things are highly correlated wither increased risk of concussions and subconcussive trauma. ALL of these things are also prevalent in the developing brains of adolescents and youth. IE: developing brains are at risk for long term detriment from traumatic brain injury; kids exhibit many of the risk factors associated with TBI.
On another note, I have a friend whose dad played for the Packers. He wouldn't let my friend play football at all growing up because of all the aches and pains and injuries he had after his career was over. My friend resented it at the time, but as an adult he is glad that he was forced to stick to basketball. The big thing to think about too is that for people in his dad's generation of players they didn't get the insane paychecks that some players do these days. His was just a middle to upper middle class family.
Post by heyyitskait on Sept 12, 2016 13:51:42 GMT -5
Oh, I also had to spine board a guy on the field because he took a hit so hard he couldn't feel/move his legs. He ended up being ok, but that was the moment I decided against football. Kneeling next to that guy, while he was sobbing, telling him "You're going to be ok," and genuinely not knowing if he would be was probably the worst feeling ever. Oh, and then having to explain to his family what had happened.
I've also taken a tackle on the sidelines. Without pads or helmet. I was on the bottom of a goddamn hog pile of fully padded players in the middle of a game. The adrenaline gave me hulk strength for like a minute but the concussion symptoms were so awful.
I asked the question because it's been an issue I've been going back and forth on ever since I read this article about Chris Borland, a former 49er's linebacker who retired very early due to concussions (it's a long article, just a warning). For background, I played football as early as I could growing up and continued all throughout high school. I have an uncle who coached at the college and NFL level and caused me to be obsessed with a particular football team for all of my life (and I still am to this day). Every day after school when I didn't have another extracurricular activity or work when I was in high school, I would be in front of the TV watching NFL Network or ESPN for the latest news, or on the computer reading about my favorite team. I loved football, and I knew what concussions were but honestly never thought they were that big of a deal, I don't think I ever received more than one.
However, after reading more about it I thought about myself and where I should stand. I decided that I don't think I'd want my kids to play. Then I started thinking about how they would react if they saw me watching football all the time, and wondering why I can watch and be a fan but they aren't allowed to play. I know I'm probably not handling this right, but I decided maybe I shouldn't support it if I wouldn't even let my children participate. For the NFL this has been easy, my interest has been waning in recent years anyway. For college football it's been much more difficult. I still constantly read blogs dedicated to my two favorite teams, and it's been a huge part of my life for a long time. Luckily I'm young and don't plan on having kids in the immediate future, but watching games on Saturday last week still felt weird. Maybe my mind will change when I am ready to have children and I can still watch and not feel odd doing so, but for now it's leaving me a little confused. That's why I wanted to know what others think.
I won't let my kids play football because I'm going to raise them to be free-spirited creative fairies. None of this all-American overly competitive hypermasculine bullshit.
Last Edit: Sept 12, 2016 14:35:56 GMT -5 by Jaz - Back to Top
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Post by snowmanomura on Sept 12, 2016 14:38:17 GMT -5
All this football talk distracted me from my original thought. I'm meeting with some recruiters from Goldman Sachs later today to talk about the positions available for people with math/engineering backgrounds. I kinda feel like a sell out.
It isn't just football that has these issues. Any high impact sport has the same long term issues (MMA, Boxing, Hockey, Roller Derby...I am sure there are others but those popped in my head first). It was a HUGE discussion/problem while I was playing roller derby (and still I am sure). Rules have been changed to try and minimize head injury/trauma on a national level in roller derby and they are constantly talking about it and tweaking the formula to keep the game enjoyable to viewer and safe to players. One of my teammates had a doctor straight up tell her she needs to stop playing (that was after she had her third concussion while playing).
I am glad that my kid was never really into football, he only played flag for a year and that is because the coach recruited him due to his size. His high school (my alma mater) has an impressive championship team that has had many college and a couple NFL players come out of it. The problem with football in general is that in order to make it safer for players, the rules of the game would have to be fundamentally changed, kind of like when they added forwarded passing. And then the question is, IF they changed the rules to protect the players and reduce hits (because even normal hits that don't cause the game to stop are enough to cause problems down the road), would it be accepted by viewers? Because the changes that would need to be made, would make it nothing like the football we watch today.
I really thought that stinky watched Adam Ruins Everything and that is where this discussion came from, they just talked about hitting/concussions from football on last weeks episode.
To be clear, I simply stated that no major studies (as far as I'm aware) have been done specifically on kids to see the affects of contact in football on their brains. I obviously agree there is a risk of damage, I was just saying that I don't think it's the same risk that is faced by NCAA and NFL athletes. My body has taken an exceptional amount of punishment over my short lifetime, mostly due to my involvement in football and growing up skateboarding (both of which I started at the age of 6.) I suffered several concussions and broke many bones over the years. I was just raised with the kind of upbringing where my dad would make sure I wasn't dying and then, if not, I'd pull it together and get back out there and do my job because that was my obligation to the team. When I wake up in the morning, my body aches and crackles like an elderly man, but I wouldn't give up all the sports I played growing up for a better body. I have not one regret. Besides, in the long run, the sports have turned out to be nothing compared to the other stuff my body has dealt with. People should just lock their kids up like Bubble Boy and let the rest of the parents handle their kids how they desire. Everybody is extremely aware of the damage hitting your head can cause now, so let them do what they want with that info (whether it to utilize or ignore it) and then move on
All this football talk distracted me from my original thought. I'm meeting with some recruiters from Goldman Sachs later today to talk about the positions available for people with math/engineering backgrounds. I kinda feel like a sell out.
you should totally work for goldman sachs but skim off extra bespoke tranche opportunities then sell them on shakedown at bonnaroo. 100% profit for you and solid returns for the college kids you are selling to, so long as the housing market continues to grow.
All this football talk distracted me from my original thought. I'm meeting with some recruiters from Goldman Sachs later today to talk about the positions available for people with math/engineering backgrounds. I kinda feel like a sell out.
you should totally work for goldman sachs but skim off extra bespoke tranche opportunities then sell them on shakedown at bonnaroo. 100% profit for you and solid returns for the college kids you are selling to, so long as the housing market continues to grow.
Because it ALWAYS grows.... it hasn't even crashed ONCE
To be clear, I simply stated that no major studies (as far as I'm aware) have been done specifically on kids to see the affects of contact in football on their brains. I obviously agree there is a risk of damage, I was just saying that I don't think it's the same risk that is faced by NCAA and NFL athletes. My body has taken an exceptional amount of punishment over my short lifetime, mostly due to my involvement in football and growing up skateboarding (both of which I started at the age of 6.) I suffered several concussions and broke many bones over the years. I was just raised with the kind of upbringing where my dad would make sure I wasn't dying and then, if not, I'd pull it together and get back out there and do my job because that was my obligation to the team. When I wake up in the morning, my body aches and crackles like an elderly man, but I wouldn't give up all the sports I played growing up for a better body. I have not one regret. Besides, in the long run, the sports have turned out to be nothing compared to the other stuff my body has dealt with. People should just lock their kids up like Bubble Boy and let the rest of the parents handle their kids how they desire. Everybody is extremely aware of the damage hitting your head can cause now, so let them do what they want with that info (whether it to utilize or ignore it) and then move on
How would they even be able to conduct those studies? My kids can play sports where they don't slam their heads into each other repeatedly, acting like thats being some kind of super overprotective parent is pretty ridiculous. Your whole post reads like an argument about why kids should not play football.
To be clear, I simply stated that no major studies (as far as I'm aware) have been done specifically on kids to see the affects of contact in football on their brains. I obviously agree there is a risk of damage, I was just saying that I don't think it's the same risk that is faced by NCAA and NFL athletes.
And what I am saying is that what you are aware of and what you think run contrary to reality. If you are interested the Cincinnati Children's Hospital has a great pediatric brain trauma center and they (among others) have done a lot of research particularly case studies regarding concussions in contact Sports in adolescents and Youth. There was a whole Symposium specifically related to brain injury in children in contact and non-contact sports at the society for Neuroscience conference last year and it is a big area of research particularly in regards to the NFL and the current issues regarding football and concussions.
I'm glad that you have grown up and haven't experienced any serious injuries but concussions at a young age or a high indicator of increased dementia and Alzheimer's and CTE risk later in life that has been shown through multiple studies.
I think it is a really important issue especially with the popularity of football both at the Collegiate and professional levels in America and it's something that needs to be discussed openly. Particularly because it creates an environment where misinformed opinions can flourish. Dismissing risks because of anecdotal evidence or dismissing people with different levels of risk tolerance and treating them like they want to put kids inside a bubble is not conducive to an open discussion.
To be clear, I simply stated that no major studies (as far as I'm aware) have been done specifically on kids to see the affects of contact in football on their brains. I obviously agree there is a risk of damage, I was just saying that I don't think it's the same risk that is faced by NCAA and NFL athletes. My body has taken an exceptional amount of punishment over my short lifetime, mostly due to my involvement in football and growing up skateboarding (both of which I started at the age of 6.) I suffered several concussions and broke many bones over the years. I was just raised with the kind of upbringing where my dad would make sure I wasn't dying and then, if not, I'd pull it together and get back out there and do my job because that was my obligation to the team. When I wake up in the morning, my body aches and crackles like an elderly man, but I wouldn't give up all the sports I played growing up for a better body. I have not one regret. Besides, in the long run, the sports have turned out to be nothing compared to the other stuff my body has dealt with. People should just lock their kids up like Bubble Boy and let the rest of the parents handle their kids how they desire. Everybody is extremely aware of the damage hitting your head can cause now, so let them do what they want with that info (whether it to utilize or ignore it) and then move on
I get what you are trying to say but the truth of the matter is, just because it hasn't affected you now doesn't mean that it won't in the future. The studies that have been done on concussions show that any impact to your body that juts your head forward/back/sideways/whatever is causing damage to your brain, regardless of your age. And it isn't even seriously impactful hits that are causing damage or even actually hitting your head that causes these damages and that is what is important to understand. It might take 30 years for those damages to compound and then show up which is what we are now seeing in older, retired football players. Which is why you have some saying they would never let their children play, or that say that if they knew then what their lives would be like now, they would have chosen a different path.
Post by thepeppers on Sept 12, 2016 15:38:57 GMT -5
Not to interrupt this children playing football convo, but my interview went really well today! Lasted two hours....it was a lot more conversation than getting asked questions. Also said I would hear back from them no later than next Wednesday. They have been great about following up quickly. Also, the VP and I seem to get along very well and have a lot in common. We have the same bachelor's and master's degree from the same university.
Although snowmanomura is like super smart, everything he says involving football is wrong because he roots for the Vols....amirite?
Because Launchpad appeared in DuckTales and we used Roboduck as the Superman character, the hero who gets all the glory as opposed to Darkwing, fans try to connect the two realities. They are two different universes in my book. We work in the alternate Duckiverse.
I don't want any kids of my own. But if I did have kids, I rather they play baseball or soccer than football. I don't think I'd say no, but I'd prefer they did something else.
I don't want any kids of my own. But if I did have kids, I rather they play baseball or soccer than football. I don't think I'd say no, but I'd prefer they did something else.
But then you have to regularly sit through little league baseball games, on second thought, I may just let my kids give each other brain damage.
Not to interrupt this children playing football convo, but my interview went really well today! Lasted two hours....it was a lot more conversation than getting asked questions. Also said I would hear back from them no later than next Wednesday. They have been great about following up quickly. Also, the VP and I seem to get along very well and have a lot in common. We have the same bachelor's and master's degree from the same university.
Although snowmanomura is like super smart, everything he says involving football is wrong because he roots for the Vols....amirite?
Not to interrupt this children playing football convo, but my interview went really well today! Lasted two hours....it was a lot more conversation than getting asked questions. Also said I would hear back from them no later than next Wednesday. They have been great about following up quickly. Also, the VP and I seem to get along very well and have a lot in common. We have the same bachelor's and master's degree from the same university.
Although snowmanomura is like super smart, everything he says involving football is wrong because he roots for the Vols....amirite?
I don't want any kids of my own. But if I did have kids, I rather they play baseball or soccer than football. I don't think I'd say no, but I'd prefer they did something else.
But then you have to regularly sit through little league baseball games, on second thought, I may just let my kids give each other brain damage.
Don't the parents just get drunk and heckle the umpire anyway?
Where I lived the football leagues are non contact until 3rd grade (flag football). I couldn't imagine any leagues younger having fun contact - sounds super dangerous.
People who have children/plan on having children, would you let your child play football, knowing what we know about concussions and how big of a deal they are? Also, does anyone feel guilty about watching football?
No way. I don't feel guilty about watching football because I don't watch it. But an adult playing football is entirely different than a child.
My kids have not and will not ever play organized football while they are still developing physically.
Not to interrupt this children playing football convo, but my interview went really well today! Lasted two hours....it was a lot more conversation than getting asked questions. Also said I would hear back from them no later than next Wednesday. They have been great about following up quickly. Also, the VP and I seem to get along very well and have a lot in common. We have the same bachelor's and master's degree from the same university.
Although snowmanomura is like super smart, everything he says involving football is wrong because he roots for the Vols....amirite?