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Ugh. You do need to be an expert to realistically call out a team using anything other than last year's W/L total. The Jets spent a lot of time and effort to improve the talent across the board, so to act like they're walking into 2013 with the same team they ended 2012 with isn't fair. The team that ended 2012, mind you, won 6 games with one of the ten worst QB seasons since the AFL/NFL Merger. By that I mean, the team won 6 games in spite of the Qb position. The team will not have a repeat there, either Sanchez improves or he's replaced with Geno. I think Geno's starting games before Week 6, fwiw.
And just because you don't know who Jeremy Kerley is doesn't mean he's not worth mentioning. They also have Braylon Edwards, Kellen Winslow, Stephen Hill, Zach Rogers (what upppp Tennessee) and some other guys who I won't mention (yet) who are having fantastic camps. Just because you don't know all of them doesn't mean they're bad.
Let's mark today as the day you called out Christopher "Tusk" Ivory as being "no" runningback.
The defense has never been below average in the past four seasons. Since Rex came to NY he's never put a unit out there that finished worse than 8th.
I know who Jeremy Kerley is and he is not a legit #1 WR. Chris Ivory has never had a really good season. I know he was in a pass 1st offense in NO, but he is nothing special. He has had some good games but even when players went down and his number was called he could not perform on a consistent basis. The Jets could have the worst offense in the league and that defense is not holding teams to 14 points a game like it used to. They are just not good. Sorry man
Wait, since when are only #1 WR's worth knowing? Kerley is primed to be one of the best slot receivers in football this year.
Ivory being stuck behind good players in New Orleans (Pierre Thomas was established, Sproles played a different role and Ingram was a high draft pick) doesn't mean he can't be good himself. He carried that team through long stretches when all the other backs were hurt.
And you're putting words in my mouth. The Jets don't need a defense to hold teams to 14 points every week to win games. They will have an elite defense and if they don't turn the ball over and gift points to their opponents (they lead the league in this regard last year) there is no reason an 8/9 win season is an unreasonable prediction.
I will say that the Jets could win maybe 6 games, but that is bc they play in one of the worst divisions in the NFL. The AFC also is horrible as well. So that is working for you
So, you're best case is they win as many games as last year with an easier schedule, better roster and better coaches? How do you justify this line of thinking?
Post by Mista Don't Play on Jul 29, 2013 14:52:23 GMT -5
The Jets are one of the teams that could really go in either direction this year. Are they going to be great? No, I highly doubt it. Are they going to be drafting first next year? No way. They are better than they were last year and if they offense can fix itself a bit they can possibly make a little noise. I think making the playoffs will be tough, but who knows. There is a large window, anywhere from 5-9, as far as wins go. Part of that depends on how the Pats fill their holes, how much better the Dolphins really are, etc. Its almost impossible to get a confident read on how each team's season is going to turn out at this point.
I know who Jeremy Kerley is and he is not a legit #1 WR. Chris Ivory has never had a really good season. I know he was in a pass 1st offense in NO, but he is nothing special. He has had some good games but even when players went down and his number was called he could not perform on a consistent basis. The Jets could have the worst offense in the league and that defense is not holding teams to 14 points a game like it used to. They are just not good. Sorry man
Wait, since when are only #1 WR's worth knowing? Kerley is primed to be one of the best slot receivers in football this year.
Ivory being stuck behind good players in New Orleans (Pierre Thomas was established, Sproles played a different role and Ingram was a high draft pick) doesn't mean he can't be good himself. He carried that team through long stretches when all the other backs were hurt.
And you're putting words in my mouth. The Jets don't need a defense to hold teams to 14 points every week to win games. They will have an elite defense and if they don't turn the ball over and gift points to their opponents (they lead the league in this regard last year) there is no reason an 8/9 win season is an unreasonable prediction.
I'm not putting words in your mouth. I'm saying that they need to hold teams to very few points to win. If you expect an offense with Sanchez/Smith, Ivory, Kerley/Braylon to put up points you are being delusional. They just don't have any that can take over game. There will be some players that will have some good games, but they do not have any game changers that can take over games on a consistent basis. The defense is just not good enough to over shadow the awful offense
TB - Loss @ne - Loss Bills - Win @ten - Win @atl - Loss PIT- Loss NE - Loss @cin - Loss NO - Loss @buf - Loss @bal - Loss MIA - Loss OAK - Win @car - Loss CLE - Win @mia - Loss
How about those Panthers though? I'm looking forward to this season. Really want to see what this offense can do with Shula this year. Defense is actually looking good for the first time in a long time. Just need some of the young guys in the secondary to show up and play this year bc it looks like we could have one of the worst secondary's in the league. Our front 7 is really good though which should help the guys in the back out. And if Beason can come back to even 80% of what he was it helps out tremendously. I also think our rookie DT (Star and Short) are going to shine from week 1. We have a shot at a wild card this year and we have not been able to say that for a while. Im guessing we go 9-7 and miss the playoffs. It does not help that we play in the best division in football IMO
Last Edit: Jul 29, 2013 15:07:37 GMT -5 by CPK - Back to Top
Aug 2 - Beyoncé and Jay-Z
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Sept 22 - Lykke Li
Oct 6 - Ought
The Jets are one of the teams that could really go in either direction this year. Are they going to be great? No, I highly doubt it. Are they going to be drafting first next year? No way. They are better than they were last year and if they offense can fix itself a bit they can possibly make a little noise. I think making the playoffs will be tough, but who knows. There is a large window, anywhere from 5-9, as far as wins go. Part of that depends on how the Pats fill their holes, how much better the Dolphins really are, etc. Its almost impossible to get a confident read on how each team's season is going to turn out at this point.
Yes, this is the correct way to talk about the upcoming 2013 season in regards to the Jets. Well done, sir.
I'm not putting words in your mouth. I'm saying that they need to hold teams to very few points to win. If you expect an offense with Sanchez/Smith, Ivory, Kerley/Braylon to put up points you are being delusional. They just don't have any that can take over game. There will be some players that will have some good games, but they do not have any game changers that can take over games on a consistent basis. The defense is just not good enough to over shadow the awful offense
The Panthers have a guy that can take over games. They won one more game than the Jets.
TB - Loss @ne - Loss Bills - Win @ten - Win @atl - Loss PIT- Loss NE - Loss @cin - Loss NO - Loss @buf - Loss @bal - Loss MIA - Loss OAK - Win @car - Loss CLE - Win @mia - Loss
That season could easily go: sweep Billdos, sweep Phins, split Pats, wins against Tenn, Cincy, Carolina, Cleveland, Oakland and boom you have 10 wins.
If you think the above is impossible, you haven't been paying attention to the NFL the past few years.
Dr. Joe - The under/over is currently around 6 or 6.5, right? I'd bet the over without hesitation (you're getting good odds, last I checked).
sang_xcx - Coming from the guy who knows the least about NFL football out of the entire board (women included)? Yeah, that's worth something.
The Jets are one of the teams that could really go in either direction this year. Are they going to be great? No, I highly doubt it. Are they going to be drafting first next year? No way. They are better than they were last year and if they offense can fix itself a bit they can possibly make a little noise. I think making the playoffs will be tough, but who knows. There is a large window, anywhere from 5-9, as far as wins go. Part of that depends on how the Pats fill their holes, how much better the Dolphins really are, etc. Its almost impossible to get a confident read on how each team's season is going to turn out at this point.
Yes, this is the correct way to talk about the upcoming 2013 season in regards to the Jets. Well done, sir.
I'm not putting words in your mouth. I'm saying that they need to hold teams to very few points to win. If you expect an offense with Sanchez/Smith, Ivory, Kerley/Braylon to put up points you are being delusional. They just don't have any that can take over game. There will be some players that will have some good games, but they do not have any game changers that can take over games on a consistent basis. The defense is just not good enough to over shadow the awful offense
The Panthers have a guy that can take over games. They won one more game than the Jets.
TB - Loss @ne - Loss Bills - Win @ten - Win @atl - Loss PIT- Loss NE - Loss @cin - Loss NO - Loss @buf - Loss @bal - Loss MIA - Loss OAK - Win @car - Loss CLE - Win @mia - Loss
That season could easily go: sweep Billdos, sweep Phins, split Pats, wins against Tenn, Cincy, Carolina, Cleveland, Oakland and boom you have 10 wins.
If you think the above is impossible, you haven't been paying attention to the NFL the past few years.
Dr. Joe - The under/over is currently around 6 or 6.5, right? I'd bet the over without hesitation (you're getting good odds, last I checked).
sang_xcx - Coming from the guy who knows the least about NFL football out of the entire board (women included)? Yeah, that's worth something.
I know enough to know the Jets aren't going to be any good.
Post by Black Dynamite on Jul 29, 2013 15:25:52 GMT -5
Just things that I think are worth noting:
While the league continues to evolve into 7 on 7, when will the defenses catch up? You've got slot recievers making as much as #1 corner backs, and TE's leading the league in statistical categories, yet secondaries and LB's across the league seem to be getting worse. The safety and OLB position is going to have to change in order to keep up with offenses around the league.
The NFC West is the best division in football. The Rams and Cardinals are even putting things together.
I agree that Clowney isn't the first OMG physical speciman, but he's more than that. He's got that on top of a terrific line of work over the past 3 seasons. Teams have been doubling him since he was a freshman, and he still consistantly puts up great games. He's a freak, he's got heart, and he seems like the type of player that has what it takes to keep growing.
While the league continues to evolve into 7 on 7, when will the defenses catch up? You've got slot recievers making as much as #1 corner backs, and TE's leading the league in statistical categories, yet secondaries and LB's across the league seem to be getting worse. The safety and OLB position is going to have to change in order to keep up with offenses around the league.
The NFC West is the best division in football. The Rams and Cardinals are even putting things together.
I agree that Clowney isn't the first OMG physical speciman, but he's more than that. He's got that on top of a terrific line of work over the past 3 seasons. Teams have been doubling him since he was a freshman, and he still consistantly puts up great games. He's a freak, he's got heart, and he seems like the type of player that has what it takes to keep growing.
Top to bottom the NFC South is better than the West. I think every team in the South will have a winning record this year. I would say that the NFC North is better top to bottom. Every team in the South and North have a chance to make the playoffs this year. The NFC West does have the best 2 teams in the NFC though IMO. STL and ARZ are getting better but they are both sub .500 teams
You are being delusional about your team. The Panthers are also way better than the Jets.
I wouldn't say way better. but definitely better. Carolina has the potential to shock everyone if Scam gets getting better, their rb's stay healthy and their defense is improved. most of their losses were by less than td last year.
One of the biggest reasons the NFL is so awesome is because it surpasses every other major sport in terms of parity. Therefore, it is certainly possible that the Jets, or some other unlikely team could win 10 games this year and unexpectedly make into the playoffs (See the 2012 Washington Redskins). However, given what we now know at this very moment about the Jets offensive prowess, I personally would not count on it. You never know, though.
Based on you think it is realistic that the Jets could possibly win 10 games. That is not happening. Do you honestly think that a team with Sanchez/Geno, Ivory, Kerley/Braylon are going to put up points? You are getting excited by Chris Ivory who has never been above a 3rd string guy. Braylon has not been Braylon in a long time. It was not too long ago that he was struggling to find a job. Kerley is not even a top 30 WR and probably lower than that. Sanchez, well he is Mark mutha fukin Sanchez. Geno is unproven. Could he be good, maybe. I wouldn't count on him with those other scrubs winning more than a hand full of games. The defense is ok, but like I said before not good enough to overshadow what could be the worst offense in the NFL
Based on you think it is realistic that the Jets could possibly win 10 games. That is not happening. Do you honestly think that a team with Sanchez/Geno, Ivory, Kerley/Braylon are going to put up points? You are getting excited by Chris Ivory who has never been above a 3rd string guy. Braylon has not been Braylon in a long time. It was not too long ago that he was struggling to find a job. Kerley is not even a top 30 WR and probably lower than that. Sanchez, well he is Mark mutha fukin Sanchez. Geno is unproven. Could he be good, maybe. I wouldn't count on him with those other scrubs winning more than a hand full of games. The defense is ok, but like I said before not good enough to overshadow what could be the worst offense in the NFL
Okay, I see you're going to continue to hang your hat on the "name the offensive players on the Jets" strategy, so here goes the rebuttal: 2009.
In 2009 Mark Sanchez was a steaming pile of sh*t at QB. The team had middling talent surrounding him and rode a fairly easy schedule to a 9-7 record and went to the playoffs. How is that different than this year? Either you get a slightly-better Sanchez (I guess) or you get Geno, who isn't going to be any worse than rookie-Mark-Sanchez.
Some of the highlights of Rookie Mark Sanchez's season: he threw 3 picks and led the Jets to an embarrassing beatdown in New Orleans; he threw FIVE interceptions and caused the Jets to lose a game where they set a franchise record for rushing yards (over 300 yards total); he had a 4-int game and got nearly beheaded in Foxboro; he threw 3 INT's at home against a mediocre Falcons team in a must-win that the team lost (and only made the playoffs after because another team blew their chance to lock up a playoff spot that week).
Kerley is a top-30 WR. Better adjust your scope on that one. Braylon is a supplemental piece. The offense uses a the TE a ton (which you keep leaving out of your positional rundown) and has a stable of RB's. Oh, and the OL that's a top-5 unit in football? That's more important than what Wr's you throw out there.
There is little-to-no chance the Jets have the worst offense in the NFL, they didn't even have the worst last year when they had their own personal worst offense in franchise history.
You are being delusional about your team. The Panthers are also way better than the Jets.
Lol. Based on what?
Based on our offense is mile ahead of the Jets offense.
QB- Cam is better than Sanchez and Geno. Not even close RB- DeAngelo and Stewart are both better than Chris Ivory. Not even close WR- Steve Smith, Brandon LaFell, Dominix Hixon, Ted Ginn Jr are better than Jeremy Kerley, Braylon Edwards, and Stephen Hill. Not even close TE- Greg Olsen is better than whoever your TE is bc whoever it is is not good enough for me to know his name. Not even close
We also have one of the best pairs of DE in the league with Charles Johnson and Greg Hardy. We drafted 2 really good DT in Star and Kawaan Short. We also get back a good veteran DT in Edwards. We have a really good LB core led by Luke Kuechly and a resurging Thomas Davis. The only thing that we need a big upgrade in is our secondary.
Based on our offense is mile ahead of the Jets offense.
QB- Cam is better than Sanchez and Geno. Not even close RB- DeAngelo and Stewart are both better than Chris Ivory. Not even close WR- Steve Smith, Brandon LaFell, Dominix Hixon, Ted Ginn Jr are better than Jeremy Kerley, Braylon Edwards, and Stephen Hill. Not even close TE- Greg Olsen is better than whoever your TE is bc whoever it is is not good enough for me to know his name. Not even close
We also have one of the best pairs of DE in the league with Charles Johnson and Greg Hardy. We drafted 2 really good DT in Star and Kawaan Short. We also get back a good veteran DT in Edwards. We have a really good LB core led by Luke Kuechly and a resurging Thomas Davis. The only thing that we need a big upgrade in is our secondary.
What you got?
So the Panthers have a better offense. The Jets have an equally better defense. Seems like a stalemate.
In no order. Just going to name WR better than Kerley
1. Roddy White 2. Julio Jones 3. Steve Smith 4. Marques Colston 5. Victor Cruz 6. Hakeem Nicks 7. Dez Bryant 8. Larry Fitzgerald 9. Torrey Smith 10. Andre Johnson 11. Reggie Wayne 12. AJ Green 13. Antonio Brown 14. Mike Wallace 15. Brandon Marshall 16. Eric Decker 17. Demaryius Thomas 18. Wes Welker 19. James Jones 20. Calvin Johnson 21. Anquan Boldin 22. Percy Harvin 23. Jordy Nelson 24. Vincent Jackson 25. Mike Williams 26. DeSean Jackson 27. Pierre Garçon 28. Steve Johnson 29. Dwayne Bowe 30. Kenny Britt
So the Panthers have a better offense. The Jets have an equally better defense. Seems like a stalemate.
WHO'S THEIR KICKER?
Your defense is not equally better. Our defense was ranked 12th last year. Our offense was ranked 10th. Y'all ranked 30th in points and 28th in passing yards
Edit: I got the Panthers offensive and defensive ranks mixed up. So the Panthers had a top 10 defense last year. So how is you defense equally better than our defense like our offense is to yours?
Last Edit: Jul 29, 2013 16:20:15 GMT -5 by CPK - Back to Top
Aug 2 - Beyoncé and Jay-Z
Aug 23-24 - FYF Fest
Sept 17 - The Breeders
Sept 22 - Lykke Li
Oct 6 - Ought
Dr. Joe - The under/over is currently around 6 or 6.5, right? I'd bet the over without hesitation (you're getting good odds, last I checked).
Its 6.5. I'd take the under for 3 months of Inforoo naming rights starting after the regular season ends. Deal?
[If its not clear, I want to have the right to determine what your name will be on Inforoo for 3 months after the Jets fail to win 7 games or more].
Now this is what I'm talking about. Some inspired parameters, Jimmy. Deal, with one caveat: the winner can't make their name something like "Jimmy is dumb" or "Flanzo is an idiot." It can be positive for the other person, though.
Also - if the Jets were actually planning to compete for a playoff spot, wouldn't they have just ponied up a 2-year deal for Brandon Moore? I mean, come on now. They have cap space too.
Willie Colon is probably going to be just as good. Remember, Moore benefit for the majority of his career by having Mangold play next to him. And last year, once Austin Howard started to "get it," Moore's job was made even easier. He's a run-first guard blocking between a future HOF-level center and a 6'8" 350 pound bulldozer at RT. Moore is obviously a good player, but I think he's always been a little overrated.
And don't forget, teams can now roll over cap space from year-to-year. It's not about spending vs. saving, so much as it's about having the same mindset for every deal and every position (save maybe QB) so you're constantly planning for the present and the future. Moore likely wanted one last payday, the Jets instead got two veteran guards (Petermand & Colon) for the same price, one of which will be replacing Moore and the other likely starting on the other side. Idzik is a beast, I just pray he keeps Rex on so they can build something substantial.