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kanye has had as big of an influence on hip-hop as anyone in the history of the genre
lol
I was going to say something about that, but I'm tired of getting into Kanye debates. I will say this about Kanye. He is the Madonna of hip/hop in his ability to completely rip off other people and sell it to the public as his own thing. And I mean that in as respectful a way as possibly can.
He's more impressive to me as a pop star than as a musician or producer.
before i continue reading thread i just have to comment on this.
I used to be the biggest Kanye hater out there. he never did it for me, never got the hype, didnt like the idea of him playing Roo, wasnt planning on missing a minute of Phil, randomly decided to go check out his set and we all know what happened. Then i heard MBDTF and all bets were off. i delved deeper into his catalog and career only to find out not only is this dude is as legit as it comes as far as music production, he has had as big of an influence on hip-hop as anyone in the history of the genre
i was dead wrong about this dude from day one and eat crow every day when i get one of his songs stuck in my head.
I feel like this is for me.
I accept your apology.
haha, more of a general "woops" but no apology was issued.
I would challenge anyone who is into Kanye to go listen to Theophilus London and then come back and tell me why I should listen to Kanye when a superior version is already out on the market.
And at least Theophilus is up front about ripping off other people's music.
Last Edit: Feb 9, 2011 12:16:35 GMT -5 by Deleted - Back to Top
Post by candyflippedaround on Feb 9, 2011 12:18:18 GMT -5
its easy to right him off because hes not the best lyricist and hes a fucking egomaniacal douche who thinks hes the only one who gets negative media attention. but if you look at what hes done, who hes worked with, whos taken influence with him, and who is currently doing whatever they can to get Kanye to write them a beat you cant deny that he is up there with the people who pioneered hip hop. his influence is still yet to be fully felt too, im sure there is going to be a wake of artists in the years to come trying to make their "My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy"
all of this coming from someone who just a few months ago would have said "yeah, whatever" to everything i just wrote
And at least Theophilus is up front about ripping off other people's music.
Kanye is pretty quick to give the likes of Dre and Wu-Tang their due credit. Unless you are referring to the actual samples he uses and then you are just ignorant about hip hop in general
Eminem solo would be a little disappointing because his live performance just isn't as strong as someone like Jay-Z.
that is just not true. I saw Jay-Z and Eminem @ the home and home tour. Eminem has a crazy energy level on stage always hype always has the crowd moving
I agree with this. I've seen Jay-Z twice (Coachella, All Points West) and Kanye once (Lolla 2008). Kanye was actually the best show and near the top of my "all time" list. I didn't go in with high expectations, but our group thought it was the best of Lolla that year (and RATM and Radiohead were the other two headliners).
I can't argue that Kanye is a great performer and gives a good live show. It was probably just a "sh!t happens" moment at his Roo show in 08, but that's exactly the reason people on these message boards are so upset at him. A lot of us sat and camped out for that show thinking it was going to be near the top of our "all time" list, and ended up getting something much more half-assed.
Is he capable of giving Bonnaroo a good show if he comes back? Yes, at least in my mind, there is no question about that. But if he was stupid enough to come back, he would never get the chance because some joker would undoubtedly throw something at him.
Yeah, my low expectations going in were based on what I heard about the Bonnaroo show. Not sure if he put in the extra effort at Lolla because he wanted to make up for that, or if it's because it was his hometown of Chicago, but my experience is that he's a great performer.
Eminem solo would be a little disappointing because his live performance just isn't as strong as someone like Jay-Z.
that is just not true. I saw Jay-Z and Eminem @ the home and home tour. Eminem has a crazy energy level on stage always hype always has the crowd moving
Well I think the home-and-home was a special deal and also included a ton of guests. I think he brings good energy, and as a Detroiter, I would love to see him. I just think some people would be disappointed with his show. I have not seen him recently, but in the past, it is nothing special.
I would challenge anyone who is into Kanye to go listen to Theophilus London and then come back and tell me why I should listen to Kanye when a superior version is already out on the market.
And at least Theophilus is up front about ripping off other people's music.
The statement "already out on the market" makes it sounds like it's Kanye, and not TL, who is the newcomer. TL has been making music for about 10 minutes, and far from being "superior," is making music that Kanye made 7 years ago.
You can interpret what I say anyway you want. I prefer TL to Kanye because I find his music interesting and Kanye's boring as shit.
And at least Theophilus is up front about ripping off other people's music.
Kanye is pretty quick to give the likes of Dre and Wu-Tang their due credit. Unless you are referring to the actual samples he uses and then you are just ignorant about hip hop in general
There's a difference between sampling and ripping off. Kanye does a lot of ripping off. And giving Dre and Wu Tang credit's pretty easy when your music doesn't really sound like theirs.
Best example I can think of...Coldest Winter. It's a Tears for Fears song that he barely changed and put it out as his own composition.
Last Edit: Feb 9, 2011 12:35:50 GMT -5 by Deleted - Back to Top
I would challenge anyone who is into Kanye to go listen to Theophilus London and then come back and tell me why I should listen to Kanye when a superior version is already out on the market.
And at least Theophilus is up front about ripping off other people's music.
I took this challenge. I didn't enjoy it and I don't see how some guy who released a couple mixtapes can compare to College Dropout and Late Registration. Give me "Through The Wire", "Get 'Em High", and "Touch the Sky" over that shit any day.
And check out Kanye West's production discography:
Jay-Z - Izzo, Heart of the City, Never Change, 03 Bonnie and Clyde, Encore, Lucifer Talib Kweli - Get By, I Try Dilated Peoples - This Way Mos Def John Legend Common - Be, Go, Testify Lupe Fiasco Nas
Probably 80% of the hip hop names people have dropped on this board have some Kanye influence.
This is the first message board I've ever been on, the only reason I joined is because I love Bonnaroo and wanted to read and talk about it all year long.
As someone pointed out in a another thread. Shows can be worked on, and revamped. I saw Eminem live once, a while back, at the height of his NO NO WORD!!! problem, right before he started to receive help for it. And yes, I was pretty disappointed. But, I'm always down for second chances. I would hope that he's worked on his live performance. Plus every time he does a performance for MTV. He kills it. So there has to be an amazing performer in there somewhere.
And the pièce de résistance
Last Edit: Feb 9, 2011 12:47:49 GMT -5 by Deleted - Back to Top
I like "Through the Wire" but it's basically a cover song with the added gimmick of rapping through a broken jaw.
A cover song of who?
Chaka Khan's Through the Fire...get it?
I actually think that one is kind of clever. But that's also from the era of Kanye I like before he started going in a more electronic wanky extended mix direction.
Last Edit: Feb 9, 2011 12:44:27 GMT -5 by Deleted - Back to Top
I actually think that one is kind of clever. But that's also from the era of Kanye I like before he started going in a more electronic wanky extended mix direction.
But how is it a cover? Does Chaka Khan rhyme all the same verses that Kanye wrote? Or is it just sampling like almost every other rap song.
Is the Eminem song "Sing for the Moment" a cover song of Aerosmith?
Before we can rip on any rapper for sampling, the first one you should be talking about is P Diddy. He basically started the whole craze. "Through the Wire" is not a rip-off of anything. It's just an amazing song.
Angst ridden? I just wanted to know how sampling became the same as a "cover song".
Because that's basically what some forms of sampling are in fact. If Jay-Z comes out and raps different lyrics to an AC/DC song, he's, for all intents and purposes, covering AC/DC.
Patti Smith changed the lyrics to Gloria. It was still a cover of Gloria.
So if Kanye samples Chaka Khan or Daft Punk or Tears for Fears in a way that's basically just using their music and cutting out vocal elements while changing the tempo or pitch, I would argue he's just doing a Kanye cover of those songs because he isn't coming up with the musical part of what makes the song great. He's just rapping or singing over it.